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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:24 pm 
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Shoe wrote:
These movies are comic books for me.

They are what 12-year-old me loved, gussied up for the modern age. Just simple, big fun.

I stopped reading superhero comics a long while back. They're just not what I'm interested in when it comes to comics.

But it's nice to feel the same wonder you did when you were 12 every now and then.

This particular movie (and its sequel next year) is the culmination of a decade of these Marvel movies, with all sorts of seeds planted and things falling into place to lead up to this one.

The real magic is seeing so many characters from different franchises come together. It was the promise of this whole MCU thing, and to see it realized will be amazing.

No one who doesn't already like the Marvel formula is going to like this. It's for fans. It's a big fan orgy...
I thought I summed that all up when I said, "Beer and popcorn", was I not clear?


P.S. 4 "I's" in one sentence, YAY ME!

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:53 pm 
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A friend and I have a bet going that this will be the biggest money-making film of all time*. He believes it will blow right past Avatar. I'm not disagreeing with his assessment, but I don't really give a shit.

(not ticket sales, just boxofficemojo standings - which usually doesn't take inflation into account).

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:00 pm 
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Blowing right past Avatar is being really optimistic. That was one of those weird blips in reality that can't be explained.

This movie will pass a billion no problem, and should hit 1.5b, but Avatar is at freakin 2.7 billion. That's insane. Even the triumphant return of Star Wars fell $700 million short of that.

Even hitting the $2b mark would be really impressive. I doubt it will get there, though it's possible.

I mostly don't care, though, as long as 1) it's good 2) it makes enough to justify more

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:23 pm 
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If it's good, it could hit $2 billion worldwide. The first one hit 1.5 and 2nd hit 1.4, so with current trends, sure.

Over $2.7 is probably not going to happen unless it is an amazing film, mixing popcorn fun with intellectual stimulation, or polarizing politics, which it probably will not be.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:42 pm 
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I still can't wrap my head around how Avatar did what it did. It was a visual delight for its time, sure, and it was a well-executed cliche that was entertaining in the moment (though who ever thinks back and says, "I have an urge to watch Avatar again?"), but the numbers it did just don't make any sort of sense.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 4:30 pm 
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Shoe wrote:
I still can't wrap my head around how Avatar did what it did. It was a visual delight for its time, sure, and it was a well-executed cliche that was entertaining in the moment (though who ever thinks back and says, "I have an urge to watch Avatar again?"), but the numbers it did just don't make any sort of sense.

See, we're not all that different. I think the same thing about these films, only they're generally not a visual delight.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 4:34 pm 
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Also a disconnect, when I was 12, Rob Liefeld and Mcfarlane were in style. I don't want my childhood Marvel comics brought to the screen.

Most of the DC stuff I read was pap too.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:25 pm 
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PENDER!!

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:55 pm 
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I'd love is Disney made a thoughtful adaptation of Marvels.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:01 pm 
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Maybe Marvels could be used to introduce Xmen to the MCU.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 8:07 pm 
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brian wrote:
Also a disconnect, when I was 12, Rob Liefeld and Mcfarlane were in style. I don't want my childhood Marvel comics brought to the screen.

Most of the DC stuff I read was pap too.


Man, that sucks for you.

When I was 12, Marc Silvestri was drawing X-Men. Walt Simonson was drawing X-Factor. Bret Blevins was drawing New Mutants. Those were the comic books I read religiously.

Liefeld taking over New Mutants was pretty much what made me stop reading comics.

(In retrospect, I acknowledge that Bill Sienkiewicz's New Mutants art was better then Blevins's, but it doesn't trigger the same nostalgia.)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 8:19 pm 
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I read DC, but much like how much I loved my Sega Genesis as a kid, I realize now a lot of it was crap.

I stuck with Superman throughout the 90s, but my fond memories of Superman comics are of the wack 1960s Silver Age comics I picked up at rummage sales. Like, yes, Jimmy Olsen turning into a porcupine and Lois Lane getting stuck in Bizarro World makes for compelling stories.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 8:20 pm 
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Attachment:
Jimmy_Olsen_Vol_1_105.jpg
Jimmy_Olsen_Vol_1_105.jpg [ 99.85 KiB | Viewed 1892 times ]


Like c'mon, this cover alone is better than any DC or Marvel film out there!


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 8:24 pm 
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I was working at a bookstore when Superman split into electric Red Superman and Blue Superman. I read that arc on my lunchbreaks.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 8:27 pm 
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Eric wrote:
I was working at a bookstore when Superman split into electric Red Superman and Blue Superman. I read that arc on my lunchbreaks.


I think that was about the time I stopped reading. Red Superman had more of a temper, if I recall.

Those were shit Superman comics.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 8:34 pm 
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That was a brief post-Liefeld venture back into comics for me. Can't compare it to what came before or after because I didn't read any of it.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 9:33 pm 
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Liefeld era got weird.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 5:20 am 
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Shoe wrote:
PENDER!!

:(

Sorry, I had no sleep the night before due to all my personal BS and finally fell over dead late yesterday afternoon.

This is not an excuse (how could I ever be excused from ostracizing such naysayers as Brian and JF from this important Marvel discussion?), it is just an explanation.

I cannot apologize enough.

:cry: :loser: :cry:

To Brian and JF, please kindly respect Shoe and the Marvel sanctity.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 9:31 pm 
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I've been way behind on Marvel films, because - well, they mostly suck. Anyway, I tried catching up today, and I'm now only two movies behind (Spiderman Homecoming and Black Panther).

Let's see...

Avengers: Age of Ultron - I had to turn this off after about 40 minutes, it's so fucking bad.
Captain America: Civil War - Well, vastly superior to the two previous CA movies, but because it relies so heavily on the Ultron to understand what's going on, I didn't give a shit about most of the things going on. Also, Tony Stark was a fucking moron in this film. And Ant Man's entry/inclusion in this film is so clumsy.
Thor: Ragnarok - OMG, I want to have this film's babies. Seriously, as close to a modern Flash Gordon film as I'll probably get this decade. Even the stupidly-out-of-place Led Zeppelin music couldn't ruin this. Glad Disney finally had the balls to make what feels like a real comic book movie. Nice touch with the Chris Foss-inspired spaceship designs, too. More like this, please.

And, of course, my wife hated Thor Ragnarok. She loves Marvel films (ALL of them), but said she will never watch this Thor movie again. I kicked her out of the house.

So, I'm digging about 2 of these never-ending (Disney) Marvel films...not awful, I suppose.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 6:06 am 
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Thor: Ragnarok is likely one of the best things in our times.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:21 am 
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Thor: Ragnarok's use of Led Zeppelin was awesome.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:55 am 
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Eric wrote:
Thor: Ragnarok's use of Led Zeppelin was awesome.

It was an obvious attempt to mimic the use of Queen's epic music in Flash Gordon. Nowhere near as effective.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:20 pm 
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I'll grant you the comparison, but if it was less effective, it was only slightly and only because it wasn't actually custom-made for the movie. Though it fits so well that it could've been.

Let's be honest here, Chris, your taste is questionable at best.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:24 pm 
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Eric wrote:
Let's be honest here, Chris, your taste is questionable at best.

I've never questioned it.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:56 pm 
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Chris Knight wrote:
Eric wrote:
Let's be honest here, Chris, your taste is questionable at best.

I've never questioned it.



It's like how if you smell bad, you never notice it, because it's hard to smell oneself.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:58 pm 
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Yeah, but I smell like roses. Manly roses.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 11:24 pm 
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I'm not sure if it justifies sitting through the 42 other Marvel films released in the past 10 years, but I enjoyed Infinity War.

LOL@
Spoiler: show
the film pretty much being a Left Behind homage. Hopefully Kirk Cameron is in the sequel.


My complaint for this film is the same that I can throw at any other Marvel film
Spoiler: show
- any sequence with Tony Stark's deus ex machina technology out of nowhere to save the scene feels unearned. Thankfully he doesn't save the day at the end of the film


Also I'm kind of tired of overly dramatic sad music when someone on screen is crying. Monty, can you ask Alan Silvestri to knock that off?


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 5:53 am 
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My son loved it, but left the theater astounded, saying "That's just part 1?"

I thought it was a lot like the comic book crossovers I remember from the nineties: a bit overstuffed with action. I've loved all these movies, but my favorite scene in the series is probably the one in Avengers: Age of Ultron where they're at the party trying to lift Thor's hammer. There's nothing like that here.

There's lots of humor, lots of cool fights and special effects, and a few things that surprised me a bit (even though it ended pretty much like anybody who read the source miniseries probably expected), so I certainly don't feel cheated, but every time you read through one of those crossovers, you had a packed cast list and a bunch of different writers moving pieces around to forward the plot, without much attention to character (and often some very out-of-character writing when characters were written by a writer that didn't work on their series). This felt like that.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 6:40 am 
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That is fair. I liked that it wasn't exhausting with the comedy. Not every scene or shot had to have a punchline attached.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 7:24 am 
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So...

Speculation so I can say called it next year,
Spoiler: show
The original Avengers cast will use the soul gem and sacrifice themselves to resurrect the newer superhero cast. Meanwhile I'll scream at the screen "But you have a time gem, use that you dummies."


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 11:02 am 
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I can't imagine that Chris Evans wants to play Cap any more, and I'm sure that Robert Downey Jr. has more money than God and is financially set for several lifetimes at this point (but, then again, so was Johnny Depp before he pissed away a billion-dollar fortune like an idiot), so they'll both be out by the end of part 2. Hemsworth might want to hang onto Thor for a while longer, due to the fact that he's never had a sizable box office hit outside of the Marvel brand.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 11:12 am 
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While I'd have liked more pure character scenes, the kind of brilliant thing about how Marvel built to this -- and also the part that makes movies like Infinity War difficult for the general public -- is that all the heavy lifting as far as characterization goes happens in other movies, allowing this big crossover to get off to a running start.

It's stuffed, but with 18 movies having come before it, it earns that.

I give the writers credit. All the characters were consistent with how they've been written. Their voice was captured perfectly throughout. Watched as a chapter in an ongoing story, everyone feels right.

I also like how the climactic moment does not come with a bang and a clatter, but with a whisper. It's dreamlike rather than bombastic. A good choice, considering how much bombast led up to it.

Two movies between now and the finale to set up a few things that will help the heroes win out in the end. Tough balancing act, making movies that stand alone on their own but that also contribute to a larger whole. When they fail, the results are messy (Iron Man 2, Age of Ultron). When they succeed, it's a load of fun (Ragnarok, Guardians of the Galaxy, Winter Soldier).

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 11:23 am 
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Shoe wrote:
I also like how the climactic moment does not come with a bang and a clatter, but with a whisper. It's dreamlike rather than bombastic. A good choice, considering how much bombast led up to it.


For all the shit that gets (web)slung at Spider-Man 3, that was another superhero bombast-fest that also ended on moments of quiet forgiveness (Peter allowing the Sandman to get away) and potential reconciliation (Peter and MJ dancing awkwardly together as the trilogy drew to a close). No forced "heroes running at the camera towards the next adventure!" stinger, no major Easter Eggs planted for what's to come next (I wonder how angry most Marvel geeks are gonna be when they were "forced" to sit through ten minutes' of tech credits for an obscure reference to the yet-to-be-released Captain Marvel that I didn't even understand until I researched it later)...both films respected the viewer enough to allow them to brood on what they just watched. Even the primary end credits -- which, in most Marvel movies, are an excuse for flashy graphics, rockin' music and fanboy shout-outs -- are here just the plainest font imaginable, set to plaintive, ghostly Silvestri music. Of course, the fact that everyone knows part 2 is coming in a year's time blunts some of the impact of this film's "deaths" (most of which will be undone somehow, because Sequels, Bitch!), but it was still a pretty ballsy thing to do, and coming on the heels of The Last Jedi mucking around with expectations in an equally bracing manner, you have to admire Disney for Going There.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 11:40 am 
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SPOILERS


...


I'd say any deaths pre-Snap are real and permanent. All the Snap stuff will get reversed, which is, of course, the point of the Infinity Gauntlet. You essentially have powers stopping just short of God's. Not a god's, but God's.

So there will be some sort of sacrifice, and the folks who got Snapped away will return. No surprise there.

I do think it undercut the moment just a bit to whisk away a couple of characters we KNOW are coming back, such as Spider-Man, who already has a sequel in the works. Even though we know these people are coming back, it still saps a bit from that moment.

But then, "I don't want to go Mr Stark" was heartbreaking. Tom Holland nailed it.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 11:56 am 
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Shoe wrote:
But then, "I don't want to go Mr Stark" was heartbreaking. Tom Holland nailed it.


Especially considering Tony's talk with Pepper earlier in the film about wanting to settle down and have kids...I'm sure Tony views Peter as a surrogate son, and seeing this eager, trusting kid who he has been grooming for a superhero life fading away in his arms must have really stung.

A lot of people bag on the comedic aspects in these films, and sometimes they do step on the emotion of a scene to add a random emotion-piercing gag (like Drax standing "invisibly" in the corner while Peter Quill and Gamora share their first -- and possibly only -- kiss), but when it comes down to the nitty-gritty, the filmmakers have shown enough tact to allow these biggest emotional beats to breathe, like the final showdown between Tony and Steve at the end of Civil War*.













*Which, if you watch Spider-Man: Homecoming right after, makes that's film's continuity extremely hard to buy into...did Tony take time out after the airport fight to personally escort Peter back to Queens, or did he do that after he chased after Steve and Bucky? Because if it's the latter, he seemed VERY quippy for a guy who just learned that his mother was murdered by Cap's old WWII buddy.

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