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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:12 am 
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You don't care about anything. You are dead inside.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:23 am 
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Shoe wrote:
You don't care about anything. You are dead inside.

Sounds exhausting.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:30 am 
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Pender, a giant book with big words, printed with more expensive ink, is automatically better than a small book with small words, printed at home with a laser printer. To suggest otherwise is silly.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:48 am 
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Chris Knight wrote:
Pender, a giant book with big words, printed with more expensive ink, is automatically better than a small book with small words, printed at home with a laser printer. To suggest otherwise is silly.

I am a silly person. Always have been.

Goes to figure I would not judge a book. Unless it is the bible or koran. Fuck those books. I read them and they both suck ass.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:33 am 
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There's a movie that I expected to come up and it hasn't, and honestly, I'd glad it didn't:

Interstellar.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 8:39 am 
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Shoe wrote:
There's a movie that I expected to come up and it hasn't, and honestly, I'd glad it didn't:

Interstellar.

Interstellar was a good movie and a good time.

Was it smart, though?

It had a lot of interesting things happen but I don't think it really provoked thoughts in the same way that, say, Moon or 2001 did.

2001 brought a lot of questions about our place in the Universe and time.

Moon brought a lot questions about the treatment of humans and slavery.

Interstellar, although the story occurred due to global destruction of our environment (an important thing, for sure), it really did not bring much more than cool things happening.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 8:48 am 
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Agreed. It posed no interesting questions and offered no interesting commentary.

I loved that it was a rare film that dealt with the weird realities of relativity and that it touched on the bizarre nature some worlds in our universe can have, in particular the planet near the event horizon of the black hole.

But aside from the forced sappiness of "love conquers all," did it say anything? Did it force us to ask questions of ourselves and our place in the world?

(I won't even get into the Matt Damon subplot, which really dragged the movie down for me.)

At best, it did touch on the emotional toll relativity's impact could have on space travelers in the future. That's a pretty compelling idea that far too few SF films deal with.

But Nolan is so damn antiseptic that even his naked attempt at mining human emotions fell flat for me, even with Mumble Mouth's otherwise excellent crying scene.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 9:06 am 
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Despite Interstellar's premise, I didn't care for its take on relativity (or anything in the movie, really). The Japanese anime, Gunbuster (and its sequel, er, Gunbuster 2) covers the exact same premise, only with a lot more emotion and characters you care about (all while parodying anime tropes at the same time). It also features a bomb made out of Jupiter's core (used to trigger the creation of a black hole), which is far more epic than a stupid tidal wave.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 10:16 am 
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I haven't seen Interstellar, but I'll credit a film that gets things as accurate as possible about space travel with being "smart" even if that's all it does.


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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 10:21 am 
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It makes nods to accuracy in that respect, and it deserves credit for that, but it also ends with
Spoiler: show
Mumble Mouth flying into a black hole and talking with his daughter several decades in the past (while he remains in the present), then flying back out of the black hole and getting rescued.
So any good will it earned with its nods to realism kind of get eroded after that.

That aside, though, yes, the way it deals with relativity is laudable.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:36 am 
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"Mumble mouth"

:lol:

I really don't get all the McConaughey Malice many people have against the dude.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:48 am 
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Oh, no malice at all. I like the guy, I just can't be bothered to remember how to spell his last name. Mumble Mouth is far easier, and everyone knows who I'm talking about. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 2:32 pm 
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Shoe wrote:
It makes nods to accuracy in that respect, and it deserves credit for that, but it also ends with
Spoiler: show
Mumble Mouth flying into a black hole and talking with his daughter several decades in the past (while he remains in the present), then flying back out of the black hole and getting rescued.
So any good will it earned with its nods to realism kind of get eroded after that.

That aside, though, yes, the way it deals with relativity is laudable.


I hate all Nolan films need to take otherwise intelligent characters, and dumb down the exposition with the hopes that the slower folks in the audience can follow along. Not only is it clumsy, the smarter people generally understand already without it being explained, and the slower audience members still won't understand what you're doing.

So stop having scientists and astronauts needing to have the theory of relativity explained in laymen terms. It hurts the film.


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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 3:39 pm 
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I don't mind having some of that for the audience -- even smart people can use reminders, especially when most science fiction ignores that stuff -- but I 100% agree that it was clumsily written.

To write it like a lesson, though, like an explanation when the characters are scientists is heavy-handed and ham-fisted.

There are better ways to do it.

You just have the characters state the data matter of fact, like a normal conversation or them checking on their situation or something. That little bit will remind the audience, "Oh yeah, relativity, that's how it works in the non-Star Wars world" without having a clunky school lesson in the middle of the movie. People will catch on fast.

Nolan is all about his Clever Ideas, though, and he's sure to remind the audience about them whenever he can. Here's his Clever Idea about dreams, here's his Clever Idea about memory, etc.

The guy is talented, but his work also leave me cold.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:42 pm 
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brian wrote:
So stop having scientists and astronauts needing to have the theory of relativity explained in laymen terms. It hurts the film.


For such a "smart" movie, Interstellar used the EXACT SAME visual explanation of wormholes with a pen piercing a piece of folded-up paper that the very lowbrow Event Horizon did.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 9:24 pm 
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Interstellar is neither smart, nor the opposite of Event Horizon (which, oddly enough, used more sound science). It's a cookie cutter character study, using star trek next generation technobabble to sound smarter than it really is. Like Nolan's microwave weapon in Batman Begins, it's dumb and stupid, and ruins what would otherwise have been a decent movie. Also, the Zimmer score adds zero emotion.

Even Doctor Who (the modern iteration) managed to create an incredibly emotional story separating two couples (a father and daughter, and a husband and wife) across time, during a goofy horror-themed storyline (Angels in New Manhattan, if you want specifics). The explanation and resolution of that conflict took all of 5 minutes to explore, and it was done far better than any part of Interstellar (which, aside from the mind-numbing lack of character development, is just awfully boring). And I don't particularly like the new Doctor Who series.

Nolan and his brother are terrible storytellers. They do not belong in this thread. Spaceballs is smarter than Interstellar.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 3:41 am 
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Monterey Jack wrote:
brian wrote:
So stop having scientists and astronauts needing to have the theory of relativity explained in laymen terms. It hurts the film.


For such a "smart" movie, Interstellar used the EXACT SAME visual explanation of wormholes with a pen piercing a piece of folded-up paper that the very lowbrow Event Horizon did.

99.9% of films/shows that give an explanation of wormholes use that example. Even scientists in documentaries do.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 6:29 am 
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I enjoyed Event Horizon. I don't think it needs to be slammed.

Interstellar is a Nolan film and thusly, I don't need to expect much more than a few cool ideas surrounded by SFX. He is like the Michael Bay of..., well..., I am still unclear of how to finish that. The Michael Bay of peanut butter? Sure.

Interstellar was an enjoyable, mostly forgettable, peanut butter movie.

8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 6:44 am 
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I never thought I'd type these words in this order, but Pender is correct.

I scanned some ratings I gave to movies and saw that I gave Event Horizon a pretty low one, 4/10, I think. Maybe even 2/10. Saw in a note that I called it "horrifically bad."

Not sure why. My memories of it aren't fond, but they aren't blistering, either. I recall it having an interesting premise and being suitably creepy, but being dragged down by gratuitous scenes of "look how horrible and unsettling this is!" and a weak finish.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 7:13 am 
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Shoe wrote:
I never thought I'd type these words in this order, but Pender is correct.

I love you.

Let's take showers together and intimately exchange body fluids.

:wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 7:16 am 
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At our age, that's easy. We're leaking from parts of the body we didn't even know we had.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 9:30 am 
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You are right. Interstellar is definitely no Prometheus. Now THAT'S a smart movie!

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 9:48 am 
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This thread reminds me that movies like Sphere exist. :down:

Hey, if you want to check out a wannabe-smart movie (akin to Mute), 2009's Cargo is pretty good. It's a bit like Pandorum, but lower budget (and it's a Swiss movie, so people with accents).

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 10:02 am 
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I liked the novel Sphere is based on, but couldn't get through the whole movie.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 11:00 am 
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Shoe wrote:
I liked the novel Sphere is based on, but couldn't get through the whole movie.


Same, except I was in a theater and stayed for the whole movie. I just tuned out after a while.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 1:07 pm 
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I'm throwing in Europa Report, not really 'smart' as in it makes you think, but a really good Sci-fi film with goodly sciencey stuff. If you, yes you, haven't seen it yet you should.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 1:46 pm 
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I swear this came up in a very similar discussion about Europa Report in another thread here or on DIMP. There's a very similar BBC show from about 10 years ago called Space Odyssey: Voyage To The Planets. It's a fake documentary about a manned trip to various inner and outer planets, and how the astronauts cope physically and mentally. A bit melodramatic, but definitely some good science and a no-brainer if you're a space nut.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 1:50 pm 
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And if you can stand anime, there's a fantastic series called Planetes, about garbage collectors in space. It's one of the best hard/smart scifi series I've ever seen. The trailer is incredibly dumbed down, especially with the English dub:


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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 6:11 pm 
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Thanks, I'll check out Planetes.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 7:50 pm 
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Chris Knight wrote:
And if you can stand anime, there's a fantastic series called Planetes, about garbage collectors in space. It's one of the best hard/smart scifi series I've ever seen. The trailer is incredibly dumbed down, especially with the English dub:



WHAT'S WRONG WITH DREAMS!? *punch*


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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 9:44 pm 
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Netflix recently added another anime series, Children Of The Whales. It's more smart fantasy than smart scifi, but it is amazing.

Also, not smart, just bonkers - the two animated Godzillla movies on Netflix - good stuff.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 6:18 am 
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Are we going down the series hole?

Then add:

Star Trek TOS
Star Trek TNG
Star Trek Enterprise
Star Trek
... fuck it, ANYTHING Star Trek
Twilight Zone
Outer Limits
Night Gallery
Doctor Who


There are more, I am sure.

But I do find it interesting that few of the Star Trek movies were as compelling as the series.

8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 2:45 pm 
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Ericubus wrote:
I'm throwing in Europa Report, not really 'smart' as in it makes you think, but a really good Sci-fi film with goodly sciencey stuff. If you, yes you, haven't seen it yet you should.

It's on the list I posted. :thumbs:

I agree, recommended. It's got its flaws, but it's a good little sciency movie (with a very small budget).

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 5:53 pm 
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Chris Knight wrote:

Also, not smart, just bonkers - the two animated Godzilla movies on Netflix - good stuff.


:down:

Your idea of "bonkers" is much tamer than mine. That first animated Godzilla movie was all talk and very, very little Godzilla. While I know that the live action films are often full of exposition and personal drama, an animated Godzilla movie doesn't have to follow that same formula. At the very least, it should have had a Godzilla that actually moved around instead of standing in one place and just shooting fire breath at approaching ships.

I fell asleep halfway through the first time I tried to watch it. The second time, I struggled to stay awake again but made it to the end for what I considered a pretty shitty payoff.

I haven't seen the second one yet so I can't comment. I'm a sucker for punishment when it comes to Godzilla so I'll end up checking it out eventually. Going by the first one though, I'm guessing the plot of the second is just a bunch of people talking, a shot of a giant lizard, a couple of people flashing back to family members dying, another shot of a giant lizard and then credits.

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 Post subject: Re: Smart Sci-Fi
PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 6:52 pm 
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I was referring to the plot - that humanity had to escape Earth, because Godzilla farted or something, then they change their minds and head back because they forgot to pack a lunch, but because of relativity thousands of years have passed, and the entire planet is now just godzilla, and the remaining earthlings are immune to it somehow, and it turns out mechagodzilla was waiting all this time to do his thing. That's the bit that's bonkers.

But, hey, at least there's more godzilla in it than the US movie from a few years ago, where he barely has a cameo...at the end.

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